Talk:Wisdom of the Crowds

This is with regards to the first entry on Wisdom of the Crowds wiki.

General Thoughts and a cautionary tale

• Inclusivity: The goal of the website from taking a cursory glance at the rules is inclusivity and acceptance. How can players expect inclusivity when you are telling them they can be excluded because other players want to exclude them? Mafia is a game with learning pains, and from what I can tell almost any type of user can join the site at almost any age.

• A warning: WOTC is a way to exclude a player from a signup list when /in to a game. To me the potential for abuse is high. MafiaScum is a niche group from what I have seen. There is definitely an "in group" as players will /in when they see a friend or acquaintance that has /in to a game. If records are not being kept and forwarded to a list mod of who dm'd the moderator to exclude a player I can see in effect the players taking control of the site on who can play with them essentially blacklisting a player from ever playing with them again. If you allow for isolation of a player based other players recommendations you are in effect trusting those players that demanded exclusion implicitly and explicitly to make decisions for the site.

If you as a mod have been dm'd by other players to exclude a particular player for past actions and when reviewing those actions you think: yes I believe they should be excluded from my game. You are seeking moral desert or giving moral desert. What is moral desert? good deeds should be rewarded and bad deeds should be punished. The good deed of the mod excluding the player because other players have asked them to exclude them; this is called "Seeking Praise". The mod, the players who asked for exclusion, the excluded player, and the community know it has happened when a mod rejects an /in from a player. If you are unaware that you are being influenced by the thought of being praised silently for doing a "good" action and also a action that is pervasive to the site and ingrained in it. You should take a few seconds try to remove yourself from the situation and approach it with a clear head. Recognize that giving people what you the mod or other players believe they deserve does not make you a god and does not make it right. This is the same argument used by the state to kill people. It was the same logic used to enslave people. It was the same logic used to deny gay rights. The passing of judgement of the mod in being the person to decide whether or not to exclude a player is a type of adulation as well. I believe only the list mod or another dedicated mod should have this power of exclusion since often the players who mod and the players who /in have come across each other often, so a third morally neutral party must decide. Their is also another incentive for mods to exclude a player that is they want to mod a game and don't want players to /out.

• Alternatives: If you are dm'd to exclude a player and you are told what actions the player has done consider adding a rule to your game such that those actions can't be done. This ensures site inclusivity. consider asking a listmod to dm'd the player who is wotc and outlining what people have said with regards to their past actions and why they are being excluded. You cannot fix what you don't know.
• Silliness: I choose not to believe that 20+ year olds have a deathnote where they write peoples names down and declare that they will not play with that person ever. It shows an unwillingness to adhere to the fundamental beliefs of the site having fun and inclusivity. I fundamentally do believe that we speak with our votes during a game. If you want that person out vote them out.
• Counter Arguments: If you fundamentally don't believe you can enjoy a game with another player in the game as well and think you are fully justified in dming a mod. Consider time, how long ago was their infraction against you? If it was a long time ago can it be forgiven? why or why not? If it was recent; consider what was the action the player did. Can you pm a mod a suggested rule so that the player does not do that action again? Alternatively Can you as an adult ask the listmod for help in mediating between you and the other player? or simply ask them to be in the pm that you are going to send another player and ask if they approve of the message? It can go as follows: "Hey player [name] we recently played in newbie game 0000 and while I respect your choices in that game when you said x or did y that really hurt me personally please reconsider doing those actions again as it made me feel less than and it makes me not want to play with you again. The game can be just as fun for both of us without resorting to those tactics that I believe are beneath you and me as players.

What if they do in fact deserve to be excluded from the game? If after reading all of this you think I am not going to subject myself to that player by dming the listmod or dming them. That is your right. WOTC still exists and can still be used.

- Political Clout (feel free to edit add or delete it)